Reliable Recruitment and Engagement Strategies with Jasmine Gorie | 070

Reliable Recruitment and Engagement Strategies with Jasmine Gorie | 070

Welcome to Lean Leadership for Ops Managers, the podcast for leaders in Ops Management who want to spark improvement, foster engagement, and boost problem solving – AND still get their day job done. Here’s your host, Leadership Trainer, Lean Enthusiast, and Spy Thriller Junkie, Jamie V. Parker. 

 Have you ever heard an Ops Manager say something like, Oh, H.R. Won’t let me do this or I mean, H.R. is getting in the way? Or maybe you’ve said that yourself before.  

Today’s Executive Series guest, Jasmine Gorie is a VP of Human Resources. And she and I are going to break down this whole Ops vs HR thing, and if you stick around to the end, you just might hear me go to confession. But that’s not all we’re talking about.   

Jasmine is going to talk about recruitment strategies and engagement strategies, and particularly how important they are in times of growth, which Sunland Logistics Solutions is experiencing right now. So it’s a fun conversation with some great practical advice.   

All right, let’s get to the formal introduction. Jasmine Gorie is the Vice President of Human Resources at Sunland Logistics Solutions, where she leverages her background in startup projects, building foundational systems and standardizing processes. Now, prior to joining Sunland, Jasmine served as the corporate HR business partner for Denny’s and held progressive roles in the paper and automotive manufacturing industries.   

So now she’s at Sunland Logistics Solutions, which is a 3PL, a third party logistics provider specializing in warehousing and value added services with a Lean culture. So Sunnland’s expertise lies in the automotive, retail, ecommerce, chemical and paper industries. They operate approximately four million square feet across the U.S., so we’re going to put links to connect with Jasmine and learn more about Sunland in our show notes, which of course you can find at our website and that is processedplusresults.com/podcast. All right, let’s jump in.

Jamie: [00:02:22] Jasmine, welcome to the show today.

Jasmine: [00:02:25] Thank you so much for having me. 

Jamie: [00:02:27] So I am excited to dig into our conversation, but before we do that, I want to start off, you know, really learn a little bit about you. So tell us a value or mantra, principal, quote, something that really embodies your beliefs about leadership. 

Jasmine: [00:02:45] So I would have to say very quickly that it’s a quote by Ronald Reagan. And it says, surround yourself with the best people. You can find delegate authority and don’t interfere as long as the policy you’ve decided upon is being carried out. And so I would say that that has been my kind of guiding point.   

Trust the people around you. If you live and walk the right example in front of them, you know what you give them. You can trust them with and then leave them alone. Let them experience and let them fail. Let them have their own successes. But more importantly, leave them alone. 

Jamie: [00:03:33] Now there you go. I’ve got some people cheering right now. All right. And then tell us a little bit about your organization. Who do you, who’s your organization serve and how do you create value? 

Jasmine: [00:03:46] Sure. So I work for Sunland Logistics Solutions, and it’s a fantastic growing one hundred top third party logistics provider. And so we’re excited about all the growth that we’re currently in the midst of and we’re expecting into our future.   

And so we serve partners across the U.S. from the automotive, retail, ecommerce, chemical and paper industries, and we’ve got a couple of other nuances in there as well. But our unique industry differentiators are our engineering and IT solutions, as well as our people focused culture, so very excited to be a part of the Sunland team and being a part of this servant leadership management team. 

Jamie: [00:04:33] Yeah, great. And tell us your role here because we’re we’re doing a little something different so far in this executive series. All of our executives have been operations executives and we’re getting a little bit of a twist and a different perspective today. So tell our listeners about your role. 

Jasmine: [00:04:51] So I serve as the vice president of human resources and safety. And so all those components environmental, health, safety and security as well as human resources are underneath my umbrella. 

Jamie: [00:05:03] Yes. So we’re going to get a little bit different perspective, and I think that’s so important. So I’m excited to hear what you have to say today. Sure. All right. So I want to start off now. You just talked about this growth that your organization is having that Sunland is having.   

And I know that you’ve recently expanded into new markets, you know, markets that you haven’t been in, so you don’t have like the institutional knowledge about it. And so I can imagine that creates a lot of challenges, probably even more heightened because now you’ve got a higher hire, a lot of folks in a market that you’re not familiar with.  

You’ve just moved into this market during a time when the employment markets are highly competitive. So can you tell us a little bit about what you’ve learned kind of through those expansions? And maybe what’s what’s helped you be successful in those expansions? 

Jasmine: [00:05:53] Sure. So one of the things that was most important for us was getting on the ground, and I think right now people are, you know, the pandemic has people a little afraid to do that, but even before then, we got so concentrated on using technology and the internet and all these different systems that we forgot to get on the ground in the market to figure out what’s going on.  

You know, what are the nuances? Because, for example, we’ve gone into the Fontana, California, market and a lot of people would just assume that that is the L.A. market. But it’s really not. It’s really not the L.A. market. So we got on the ground. We started talking to people. We started understanding, Hey, you’re tight for labor, but why will people leave? Is it money? Is it treatment? Is it culture? And we found out very quickly that everybody is paying around the same rate. So pay really can’t be your differentiator. They can go anywhere they want for the same money.   

But if you’re not talking to people with the right tone, having the right attitude, embodying the right culture, you can’t keep people and this is specific to Fontana. You may go 20 miles up the road and the challenge might be completely different. And so for me, it was important for me to get on the ground and that’s what I did. I went to California. I start beating the trees, talking to the Chamber of Commerce, which they have a smaller chamber of Commerce. 

And a lot of times we stay away from those because maybe they don’t pull the same data, but they have a lot of different relationships and they’re able to get closer to people. And so really, that grassroots approach, you know, I laugh all the time, you know, it’s what’s winning presidencies these days. So why wouldn’t we do it, you know?  

And so I’m really taking that grassroots approach and getting on the ground and formulating our recruiting strategy around what’s impacting our site instead of just kind of taking that broad approach. So that’s really been helpful. We went into that market, hit the ground, passing out fliers and doing things like that, and we had over six hundred applicants in the first week. We only needed 15 people.   

It was so easy to fill those positions and retain them because we went in with an engagement strategy early on. Let’s make sure we’re the simple things right, welcoming people, treating people right, making sure they have a T-shirt with your brand name on it, talking about your values and your culture, and then, most importantly, walking those things out in front of them.   

Of course they want food, everybody wants breakfast, and everybody wants lunch. Can’t skip that. But those are just some of the things that we did as we expanded into new markets. But if I think about anything that was most valuable was getting on the ground. You have to you have to go and see. 

Jamie: [00:08:38] Mm hmm. That sounds so smart. And I think even like for folks who aren’t expanding, they’re in their own market, even in those situations, not taking what you think you know, for granted, right? You think you know this, but is that still true today? 

Jasmine: [00:08:55] That’s right. That’s right. That’s funny. You should say that because I just got off the phone with my weekly call with my HR team and I said that exact thing. You know, the recruiting the market is so dynamic. The same recruiting strategy that you were using two months ago and it was working might not be working today. So it’s time to pivot. It’s time to change. But you have to you. It can’t just be a stagnant document. It has to live.   

You have to constantly go back to it and say, Hmm, that’s not working. Let’s pull that one back out and we’ll come back around to it. Let’s try something else. And so, you know, we especially in today’s market, we do the same things over and over again, expecting a different result. We know that’s insanity. And so really.   

But we’ve got to this point where we want to work smarter and not harder. And so it’s really kind of going against our continuous improvement mind frame, but people can’t be leaned out. That’s right. We can’t be leaned out. And so if you’re going to reach people and you want to attract and then retain those people, it has to be different for them. 

Jamie: [00:09:59] Yeah. Well, and I love this too, that you talked about kind of going in with engagement from the beginning, thinking about not just the attraction, right, not just bringing people in, but then retaining people. What makes a workplace where people want to stay? And it sounds like you were talking a lot about the experience they have with leaders and with the culture. Is that what you found to be, you know, a big differentiator or something that really has an impact on retention? 

Jasmine: [00:10:30] Absolutely. I think where we missed the boat is we’re so concentrating on the operational effectiveness and in this situation of a startup that we forget that people are actually what move the needle. And for me, I always tell my teams, you know, engagement starts from day one, put together an engagement calendar of the things that you’re going to do every week, and it doesn’t have to cost you money.   

It can be free, you know, the most effective. Everything that I’ve done in my career is to have the leader stand at the door and say thank you for all you did today. You know, thank you for those extra hours. That’s a part of your engagement calendar. You put it out there. You let your leaders know you’re intentional and you’re genuine, but you can’t think the engagement is going to happen, it just doesn’t.   

Our operational leaders, how we love them and want to partner with them, they’re not thinking about that. They’re thinking about the truck that’s going out the door. The inventory accuracy. And so H.R. Partners really have to step up and say, Hey, hey, this is our engagement calendar. This is what we’re going to do. And they’re happy to do it. They’re happy to partner with you, but they need to know how to. 

Jamie: [00:11:36] Hmm. Yeah, fantastic. Well, let’s talk about that then, because, you know, thinking about all of the changes that have happened and then working with your operations partners, you’re right. They do have like, I got to get, you know, this truck out. I’ve got to get this right. They’ve got work to do right.   

So when we talk about culture and leadership and thinking about what’s happening now, what’s happening in the immediate future, what do you think are maybe, you know, one one of the biggest challenges that you face in developing the leaders who can build and sustain that culture that you’re after? Yeah.

Jasmine: [00:12:14] You know, it’s so interesting. You know, growth is good, right? But when you grow so fast in the new markets, you really miss the opportunity to engross and embrace the newest team members. And so we’re very passionate about the Sunland culture.   

But in California, you know, how do I make sure that that site manager out there really knows what someone is all about? It’s more than the orientation, right? And so that’s why those factors around the engagement calendar and walking that path out helps them even to see, Hey, this is really important to the organization. We have to do these.   

But that’s probably the biggest challenge that we face right now is how do we duplicate the culture? So it feels the same everywhere. You know, we have a tendency for the feel of our company to be centralized here in the Greenville, South Carolina, area because that’s where our corporate offices and that’s where many of our legacy team members are. But we’ve grown so much that probably 50 percent of our team has less than two years of tenure.  

And so we do a lot of things from an organizational perspective. As far as communication meetings, we’re having a virtually where we’re congratulating people and making sure that servant leadership feel comes apart becomes a part of that meeting and going through all of our values set, you know, to make sure that people see that it’s important. 

Jasmine: [00:13:37] And then as a leadership team, we have something we call a Gemba, where each one of the SLT members is responsible to go to the sites with a certain checklist to make sure that we’re engaging with those teams and offering suggestions and kind of coaching on the spot towards our values, towards our management system and things like that.   

And so we try to use those same frameworks simultaneously all the time throughout our organization. Our CEO, Arch Thompson is a fantastic culture guy. He loves values, but he’s very clear. Let’s not change the frameworks, but let’s stay within our existing framework so people understand they’re consistent. We can say them over and over again.   

People recognize them, and that’s really what we’re trying to do to make sure that that culture, the expectations all kind of continue because it’s so hard with new markets, you just don’t get to spend the same amount of time with people. 

Jamie: [00:14:36] Mm hmm. You know, I listen to you and I my experience, my most recent experience was that FedEx and you know, having this same situation where you’re trying to get some consistency because, you know, you need that consistency in order for customers to have a good experience, no matter where they are, where they’re operating in the country, all of those things, right?   

But culture really is so dependent on that local leadership, right? We’ve all seen it where you change leaders and maybe you go from someone who or site where you really having a tough culture, you put a really great leader in in that culture transforms just from making that one change or the other way or going the other way, right?   

You’re like, Hey, we’ve got a really strong culture here and we have a leadership change. You’re like, Whoa, what happened? And so, you know, it’s a real, you know, challenge is to say, how do we create a Sunland culture? How do we create an organizational culture? How do we all belong to something where we’re part of something bigger together? Knowing that those site leaders in this individual leaders are going to have such an influence on it, right, 

Jasmine: [00:15:46] Right, right, it’s so very true and and detrimental to your business if you’re not careful. Here at Sunland, I would say we agonize over people decisions. We don’t have a site leader that probably goes through less than 12 hours of interviews with our team because we just we just want to get it right.   

And we know that the statistics say that you’re only going to get it right sixty five percent of the time. But if we get it wrong, we don’t want to get it wrong and culture. You know, we get it wrong. I’d rather get it wrong and maybe some type of operational competency, the ability to collect data or something like this. I don’t want it to be a poor value fit. 

Jamie: [00:16:27] Yeah, yeah, absolutely. All right. So you talked a little bit about and shared some of the things that you’re doing. Of course, the investment in selecting people, you know, having the Gembas, having the frameworks be consistent so that we’re not changing that.   

I see that all the time where we look at the purpose and it’s like, Oh my goodness, there are 37 pages of all the different things, which one of these you really want. So all of those things are working. Anything that you think that you may be is going to continue to be a struggle or what you’re going to try and work on next, what do you think is coming up next in this and this challenge in this area

Jasmine: [00:17:05] So one of the things it’s hard to predict, right? What’s coming next, but one of the things that we are doing to try to leverage some of the things that we do well within the organization.   

So some of the subject matter experts that we have in combination with some of the systems and frameworks are we’re really trying to create and improve a more robust onboarding experience and really trying to add more faces to that experience, right? A lot of times the manager gets the whole responsibility to go down the checklist of all these different things, but they’re not the expert.   

But we do have some people within the organization. They may not be, for example, in California, they may be in Greenville, but creating that connection and getting them connected with the person that’s really an expert in that area to go through that onboarding. So not only is the expectation met around that tactical thing, but they create another relationship so they don’t feel like they’re on an island.   

You’ve got 15 locations around the U.S. you want to try to connect people in different ways we’re also working towards. We still do like reading books together as a leadership team and having discussions, and so taking the opportunity to really have in-depth discussions and understanding each other’s perspectives from around the US on this one book that we’re all focusing on, it kind of just bring some synergy to what we’re doing and helps kind of develop that relationship around. And the books are always around one of our value sets, right? So we’re not straying from that. Yeah. 

Jamie: [00:18:41] Awesome. And let me just ask you this, because we’re talking about it and we’re assuming, OK, maybe everybody understands, but just in case you know this challenge, why do you think this challenge is so critical for you to put in this effort? You know, like what makes it important enough for you to put this energy and effort and time and investment in on it? 

Jasmine: [00:19:00] So for Sunland, we believe that culture is the differentiator. You know, you’re going to go into markets and we’re all going to pull the same wage survey, probably from the same provider. You know, that’s just how it is. And so there are only certain places went from a compensation perspective that you can really compete. You know, the person who is going to win, it’s going to be the person who has a strong strategy and execution on culture. That’s what we believe. That’s what we believe. And so we’re going to put our efforts there.

Yes, the IT solution, yes, the engineering solution, that’s a value that the customer wants, but they also want a stable process. And the only way that you’re going to do that is with your people. We believe here 80 percent of what we do is people in 20 percent is process. And what that being the fact you’ve got to concentrate on the people, you can’t treat them bad and you definitely don’t want them rotating in and out of the door because it creates an unstable process not only for you, but for your customer.

Your customer is going to feel it eventually. Hmm. So it’s really important to focus on culture, to focus on people. If that’s really where the difference lies, you know, it’s really our own. It’s our only variable factor when you think about it in business, like we learn how to control just about everything. We can not get this PayPal thing down. And so for me, it all comes down to you. Better treat them right. 

Jamie: [00:20:24] Hmm. Yes. And I’m hearing you, I’m like, no wonder you really want to hire site leaders and leadership leadership teams that are aligned with you on that? 

Jasmine: [00:20:33] Yes, absolutely. 

Jamie: [00:20:35] Yeah. Ok. Well, I do want to just touch base because about this whole H.R/ Ops thing. Ok, so we had a I had a guest on recently. Javon was talking a little bit about sales and ops, but one of the things I think this is a miss for the operations managers is just what I’ve seen is so often. Here’s what I’ll talk to.   

I’ll talk to operations leaders and here’s what they say is that H.R., they won’t let me do this. They’re making it hard for me to do this right? And almost like HR, you know, H.R. partners are obstacles. And I just think that that is the completely wrong way to look at it. So if you’re in operations, you’re listening right now, stop doing that and stop saying that. But yes. So Jasmine touched me a little bit about, you know, from your perspective, what do you think are things that we need to consider as operations and HR, our partners and professionals partner together in their organizations. 

Jasmine: [00:21:34] You know, very, common comments, right? HR is the police, probably I’ve heard throughout my career. But for me, the operations and HR partnership is so critical and there needs to be a hand-in-hand mentality there and not just on one side, but on both sides, because one without the other can’t be successful in the environment that we live in today.   

With the nuances and the complexity of employment law operations leaders need human resources and human resources, need the operational leaders because they’re the ones that are making the decisions on the floor. So we need to come together and there’s no side I like kind of reminds you kind of almost like a marriage. We’re not on opposite sides. We’re on the same side. We want the same thing.  

And we actually all have the greatest of intentions for the organization. We just don’t always articulate in the way that that is as clear. You know, often operations does look at HR like a brick wall trying to get in their way, but I really wish they would look at it is we’re really trying to keep the brick wall from falling on you. I’ve never intentionally tried to make it hard for operations. 

And for the HR people who may be listening don’t make it intentionally hard for the operations, but HR is there to create and to provide some guardrails for you that will get you in trouble. And that’s the reason why the function has grown and has become such a strategic partner because the value has been seen there and you know that you do run into your occasional HR professional. That’s a little egotistical and a little overconfident and things like that, but on the same thing with the operations side.  

But sometimes it’s hard to hear. No, but both sides have to ask and understand the why. And that’s the critical part. You know, I tell my HR leaders all the time, you know, operations needs to be your best friend. The best compliment I ever received was that I was the plant manager’s right hand person, you know, and nothing, nothing came in our plant. No one came in. No idea was presented unless I’d seen it first.   

That’s how great of a relationship that we created. That takes time and that takes effort, you know, and it takes being a customer service person in every transaction. You’ve got to take a step back and say, OK, I’m a customer service person. I’m human resources, but I’m here to service the customer. And it’s that operations leader taking a step back and saying, Yes, I’m the operations person, but I don’t know everything in this area, so I need to have somebody who can help me.   

And those two mentalities coming together are winning thought processes. But when one is always trying to reject the other, you can never see. Contentious relationships between operations and HR are just sad, you know, they really are. And I hate that because when I went, when I served in a site role, my number one person was my plant manager. I wanted my site manager. We needed to be in lockstep. You know, we talked constantly. We touched base constantly. You know, I was always a step ahead. I stayed a step, a step ahead, not because I wanted to beat him to something, but because I wanted to have that proactive partnership with him, I wanted him to know that.  

I mean, essentially I had his back, you know, and I was there, you know, hey, I’ve already been thinking about that. Here’s where we should be. Here’s where we should be thinking about or we’re already behind in this area. So I want to get it to you before we get too far behind, are we or we lag too much? We need to make action.   

But one of the things I think H.R. doesn’t do enough of is we don’t bring enough data to the table to really bring ourselves to a level of that we’re actually qualified to make the recommendations and we have the the the information that really justifies what we’re recommending. A lot of HR professionals are still going off gut feel. And I think that that is a hindrance to the operation as well. So I encourage the HR. People bring the data.   

Operators are moving and living off data. You need to live it and bring yours to the table as well. And I think that that makes the partnership a lot more stable because you’re talking from the same value set because a lot of times you’re going to find that your turnover data is core correlate directly with quality issues, safety concerns.  

You’ll find it you and you already have to just map it straight across. This week, we lost 10 people. We also missed orders to the customer. You know, what are we going to do? What was the value, what was the impact, the financial impact of those people leaving? The customer orders? Maybe we should just want to buy dollar, you know? 

Jamie: [00:26:36] Right? 

Jasmine: [00:26:37] I mean, you know, you have to find those correlations and maybe sometimes I do quicker than others. But one thing that I think the HR people need to do as well. And I don’t know how many HR people listen to this call, but maybe there’s an operations partner that can advise them, make friends with your finance people. One of the most influential relationships I ever had in my career was with a finance manager that took me under his wing and taught me the business side of things.   

And being able to leverage that throughout my career has been huge. And so a lot of times that’s not a place where HR has a lot of strength as understanding those financials. But it’s critical, you know, and it makes you relevant when you come to the table. If you understand the business side, at least some of the finance, you have to understand everything, but you should understand the financials. 

Jamie: [00:27:25] Yeah, I can just imagine like that just raises the conversation and to a strategic level, right? We go from just kind of talking about the tactics to being able to talk strategy. Right, right. Fantastic. All right. So as we wrap up, I’ve been this is so fun having so much fun. But as we wrap up, Jasmine, what words of encouragement or advice would you leave listeners with today? 

Jasmine: [00:27:49] I think the most important thing I want people to get from the time that we’ve spent together is we’ve come to a time in our working lives whereas leaders we have to focus on people and. There’s been lots of talk about the pandemic and the tight labor market and all the choices that those individuals have. Now is the time to focus on people to really hone your people strategies.  

Don’t let them go by the wayside, spend the money. It’s one hundred percent worth it, and I believe that you’ll see some benefit in retention. The value of retention today is so much more than it’s ever been. You know that that training, that knowledge, that understanding we do it so fast now, but. But we can’t forget to focus on the people. 

Jamie: [00:28:48] Great, great message, I love it. Thank you so much for coming on today, sharing your perspective, giving some tips and loved all the tips that you had. And then what we’ll do is in our show notes, we’ll kind of just link to your information. People can connect with you or learn more about Sunland. So Jasmine, thank you so much for joining us today.

Jasmine: [00:29:08] Jamie, thank you so much for having me. I enjoyed our conversation. Would love to come back. HR is my passion. HR and Operations relationships is one of my one of my favorite things to talk about. So we love to be able to dive in deeper on some of these topics as well. 

Jamie: [00:29:25] Yeah, maybe we can do like a panel type of, you know, HR/Ops discussion. 

Jasmine: [00:29:31] That would be fun. Yeah. 

Jamie: [00:29:33] All right. Well, thank you so much.

Jasmine: [00:29:35] Thank you. 

Jamie: [00:29:39] And Jasmine shared so many great perspectives and ideas, so think about some of the things you heard, you know, recruitment strategy, get on the ground, grassroots are one of our favorite phrases. Go and see, you know, don’t take for granted that what did work will continue to work.   

You want to make sure that you don’t make assumptions and you really go and see and get on the ground and find out what’s working and what people need and want. She also talked about engagement, starting with day one, and you heard her kind of go through this idea of of incorporating engagement into the recruitment process.   

Jasmine shared different ways that they tackle engagement and particularly how they’re helping leaders to be able to engage more with teams while still managing their operational business. Now, perhaps you resonated with some of the challenges and work and improvement that they’re tackling as they kind of look at how do we how do they how does some land duplicate culture and create alignment with a broader culture across multiple sites? Or maybe the work that they’re doing right now to create a more robust and more connection building onboarding process?   

Now I know you heard this part. Jasmine and the team at Sunland believe that culture is the differentiator. And of course, we had our whole HR/Ops partnership discussion. Keep listening for confession. So what about you? You’re one next step. Well, I want you to think about what is your one key takeaway. You know, the thing that you want to run and tell someone about say,  

Oh, I was listening to this podcast, and Jasmine said this, and it made me think, What is that one thing for you? And you want to share it, reflect on it and share it, and I would say consider sharing it on LinkedIn as well. 

Jamie: [00:31:24] Reflection and sharing our reflections is a great process to build your brain and build your habits. So if you post on LinkedIn, you can tag me at Jamie V. Parker and tag Jasmine. Just remember, we’ll put that her her links,in the show notes. Now, before confession, a quick reminder that we wrap up our Q4 executive series next week with Chris Chippindale from Credit Union, who is going to talk with us about building a leadership bench in today’s employment market.  

So you probably won’t need him for that one. And we’ve had some great guests, so if you miss any of them, you can head back and you can hear from Dave Conner, who’s the CFO and CEO at Anchor Industries. Kelly Ogunsanya, who’s the CEO at Stride Community Health Center. And David Pender, the VP of operations at Sage Glass.   

All right, confession time. Now, I’m sure this comes as a shocker to all of you, particularly those longtime listeners who’ve been with me for a year. I have absolutely said those words before. H.R. won’t let me, H.R. is making it difficult.  I know the shocker, right? So earlier in my career, I really saw HR as an obstacle to me doing what I want to do, right? So you can imagine me, imagine me like deep in command and control.

Jamie: [00:32:40] What does HR make it so hard to fire someone? Why won’t H.R. let me do what I want to do? So you can imagine that, right? Like, I don’t think that’s much of a shocker for anyone now mid-point in my career. This is the real confession. So midpoint my career, I kind of started to build a close relationship with HR. But in this, this, you know, here’s the thing, right?   

So it wasn’t because I valued the work they were doing. This is the real confession part. It was because I was trying to get their help. I had recognized, like I’ve now learned that I need them right. Battling with HR is not going to do it. So now I know that I need them, so I kept my HR partner in the loop. I asked her for advice. I got her involved early.   

I really worked on building that relationship, and my current version of me would like to say it was all in good faith because I could see the value. But the truth is that at that time, I saw that partnering closely with HR on the front end help things move more quickly on the back end. So if we had to move toward performance management or termination, you know, it was easier to do because I’d already cut this person loop and had gotten them involved and asked for their feedback early on. So those were still during the command and control days. 

Jamie: [00:33:55] Now, after that, when I was going through my leadership transformation, when I started showing up from a place of vulnerability of knowing that I needed help and didn’t know as much as I thought I did right. I started seeing the value that people bring to the table, and I could see how much value HR partners bring, not just on knowing HR policy or on compliance, but as a strategic business partner.   

Now, since that time right now, I had different HR partners, you know, after that revelation and those different HR partners had varying levels of strengths and skills. So I know that not every HR partner is a strategic partner. And so I loved actually hearing Jasmine challenge our HR listeners to learn the financials and the operations and be that strategic partner.  

But even those that weren’t quite as strong or as skilled as I would have wanted still brought value. So when a manager on my team started to say, well, H.R., then I knew we had some work to do. We had some of that foundational work to do on their belief system and where they were coming from so that we could move them out of that victim space and into a place of working cross functionally and building strategic partnerships. So ops managers stop saying it. I want you to figure out how to partner. Ask for help. Share what would be more helpful for you if you’re not getting it in work, cross functionally with your business partners. All right. Bring it over until next time.

 

 

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